Pin removal tool question...

[Nicholas]

A few years ago while installing an alarm system on my Harley motorcycle I purchased a electric pin removal tool. Is is a metal disk about two inches in diameter with a assortment of about one and one half inch pins around the outside circumference. Could this be the "proper" type tool you are referring too? Just courious...
Just placed a order to SmartieParts yesterday for theArea 51 cruise control unit. Want to say, "Thanks!" to all of you involved for your efforts and time in this product...very much anticipated and greatly appreciated!!! Nicholas

[Harleyduo]

I think the type of tool Nick was talking about can be found at JP Cycles for #10.99 (American).  I found it by searching on Yahoo under "Electric Pin Removal Tool". I tried to post a picture here, but obviously, I didn't do it right so I just decided to give everybody this information.   Since I'm also a Harley rider, I had experienced the idea of using this tool when I once needed to work on my electrics, but at the time I had my local dealer do it instead of tackling it myself so I don't have a clue as to how well they work.  It almost looks to me like it is both a removal tool and installation tool built into one and also capable of doing different sizes.

Maybe those involved with the production of this product can give us a better idea of how it might work?

[SmartieParts]

Having worked on the smart and installed a few of these cruise controls now... I can answer this one.

That tool probably will not work.  The hole on the connector in question is tiny - a scant 1.0mm x 0.5mm - and all the "prongs" in that picture look too big.  The only one that might be an exception is a forked 2-prong style, and you need a single prong to remove them.  If it was small enough though, you could clip one off.  For $11 that would be a heck of a find because the proper ones (here's a link) out of Germany are closer to $25 and you have to pay shipping overseas.

To reverse the install, you need the forked variety.  Again, here's a link from Germany.  So you'd need 2 of those $11 ones - one clipped, and one as-is (again, provided it is small enough and I'm not sure it is).

Or you can do both install and reversal with a couple of staples

Really, it works.  I've done a few of them now and the worst part of using the staples is pricking my finger with it.  But even that, once I figured out you don't need really any force on the staple... it's all good.

 - Steven

[Nicholas]

Thanks SmartieParts and Harleyduo, that is the exact pin removal tool I bought and after closely looking at it, it will not work. The pins are too big to slip into the connector with the wire still inside...Was just a thought, but will use a staple or maybe a rather thin small style paperclip. Will just have to wait and see...Thanks for the help guys!

[nscaler]

Got the Cruise Control today. Got the switch mounted and the wire run. Got my staple and bent to the correct shape. Removed plug. Released pins. Put the staple in the correct spot and... nothing. No release. Tried several different pins. Different depths of "penetration". Wiggling.
Finally got one loose. But no more.
I noticed there are two barbs sticking out. The staple is only releasing one side.
Help!

[admin]

One side is latched with the barb... that's what you're hitting with the staple.

The other side is latched with the white pin lock mechanism.  Did you do that step?  The pin lock has to be shifted otherwise they will NOT come out!

But it is correct that you are only engaging one barb with your tool.  Make sure to look at the close-up photo in the instructions to be sure you've got the tool in the correct place.

Remember - really no force at all necessary.

[Tom P.]

Re: Put the staple in the correct spot and... nothing. No release.

If you read my post "AWESOME Accessory", you will see that I had a very difficult time removing the pins as well.  It seemed to me that the staple wedged the pin in place when it was depressing the barb.  When I started removing the staple while pulling lightly on the wire, the pin would release.  But it took numerous tries on each pin.  You have to be really patient and keep trying.  Perhaps my staple was too heavy-duty as was the jeweler's screwdriver that I was using.

[Arch]

To those of you concerned about using the stable: As a lifelong gearhead, I like to use the right tool for a given job, too. But rest assured, the staple truly does work perfectly. Read the tips mentioned above and insert while gently pulling on the wire, and once of them pops out, it'll all make sense and the rest will go easily.

[sparky73]

You don't need a special tool to remove the pins. I have a Swingline heavy duty stapler and the staples worked great. Standard staples are too small and some construction staples may be too big. It takes very little pressure to insert the staple and release the pin. If the pins don't come out easily, you either have the wrong size staple or you are not inserting the staple in the right location. There is an excellent picture of this procedure in the installation instructions. Maybe a couple of staples could be included with the cruise control to avoid confussion, frustration, and this thread.

[nscaler]

I'll try a smaller staple next. I was having to push pretty hard. Now I know that it should slide in easily (staple). And yes the block was pushed to the side per instructions. Thanks!

[admin]

I think some of the confusion comes from people mistaking "heavy duty staple" with a staple gun type staple or similar.  A heavy duty staple is exactly like a common staple but maybe 1.5 times as thick.

I want to stress that it should be easy, but does not work 100% of the time because you do have to engage the barb just right. If you are too far in any direction it won't hit.  The answer is NOT pushing harder, it is simply to try again.  And this is the case with the staple OR with the proper "Mini-ISO terminal extraction tool".  Last night after getting another staple complaint, I sat down at my kitchen table with a fully loaded connector (20 pins) and removed 100 pins with the staple and 100 pins with the "proper tool".  It took me 121 attempts to remove the 100 pins with the staple and 119 attempts with the extraction tool.

The slight edge just isn't worth the expense.  So I think those that are having troubles with the staple are, as suggested above, either using the wrong staple or inserting it improperly but would have the same trouble whether or not they had the proper tool.

I do appreciate the suggestion we supply the staples.  One person even implied by email we shouldn't be "so cheap"   At one third of a penny each, I assure you it isn't because of cost.  Not directly anyway.  We originally were going to do this, but the time it takes to break off the staples and give each person 4 or 5... the medical bills alone would be preventative.  It probably sounds like I'm joking, but our assembly workers drew serious blood that first day!  So we stopped after the first few.

It won't help you early adopters, but we're working on designing a custom tool for the job that would be better than either the staple or the "proper" tool.  It takes a lot of time to design, then submit for quotes etc and of course it may be impossible to do it cost effectively.  But there have been enough complaints regarding the pin extraction that it is obvious we should do something to make it easier.  I'm also working on better instructions that can make the procedure more clear, because obviously many of you are getting on just fine.

The procedure (staples) DOES work.  But yes, it has to be better.  Thank you for your continued feedback and patience and understanding.

[Flashman]

For $500 bucks you could not include one of these magic staples?

On my 2nd hour trying to make the darn pins move... sigh... everything else was easy...

Will keep trying...

[Flashman]

Got it finally... my recommendation is to include a pin of the appropriate guage in future shipments and clarify the documentation to say the hole "above" the pin and not "besides". Also a piece of double-sided velcro tape to hold the control unit in place would help (I happened to have some).

[Flashman]

Darn one of my pins in the red thing is in the wrong place... any instructions on how to remove that one? Seems this red connector is extra aggressive, with teeth on BOTH sides...

[Flashman]

Two words for future improvement: Y-Adaptor

These pins are really a pain...